BuzzBuzz

12-02-2011, 07:34 PM

How are the points calculated that are awarded for solving a cryptogram?

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BuzzBuzz

12-02-2011, 07:34 PM

How are the points calculated that are awarded for solving a cryptogram?

pootie49

12-02-2011, 09:09 PM

Please see this post for the answer to your question

http://www.cryptograms.org/forum/showthread.php?t=194&highlight=scoring

basically an easy puzzle is scored less and you are awarded more points for avg and then difficult.

time also makes a difference if you solve faster you get higher points, Maradnu's calculations are

actually spot on. Based on times of twenty seconds and over.

The scores for solving under twenty are a bit higher.

http://www.cryptograms.org/forum/showthread.php?t=194&highlight=scoring

basically an easy puzzle is scored less and you are awarded more points for avg and then difficult.

time also makes a difference if you solve faster you get higher points, Maradnu's calculations are

actually spot on. Based on times of twenty seconds and over.

The scores for solving under twenty are a bit higher.

BuzzBuzz

12-03-2011, 02:06 AM

Thanks for the reply Pootie. If you tell me where I can find the actual formulas used, I would much appreciate it.

pootie49

12-03-2011, 03:26 AM

You would have to send an email or private message to Admin to find out the actual

formulas although I am curious as to why?

formulas although I am curious as to why?

Lily H

12-03-2011, 06:05 AM

Why are you asking all these questions about scoring BuzzBuzz when you haven't even attempted to play a single game? Are you trying to create a rival cryptogram site or maybe you're writing a cheating program so you can get fast solve times?

BuzzBuzz

12-03-2011, 06:11 PM

Hi Pootie and Lily:

Thanks for your comments.

I am a mathematician by training, and I am curious about some odd things I see related to the bell shaped curve that accompanies the time (in seconds) it takes for one to solve a cryptogram.

There are five numbers shown at the bottom of each bell shaped curve, which I assume are related to the statistics of the collection of times taken by all the solvers for one cryptogram , or perhaps just including solvers who are competing. For discussion purposes, I name these five values from left to right as follows: Min, Low, Mid, Hi, Max.

I discovered that the ratios of Max:Mid and Hi:Mid are always the same: 5.0 and 3.0 respectively. But, the ratios of Mid:Min and Mid:Low change for each cryptogram. For the five cryptograms I have just looked at, the Mid:Min ratio range in value from 4.67 to 6.78, and the Mid:Min ratio range in value from 1.65 to 1.73.

Statistically, this makes no sense.

Thanks for your comments.

I am a mathematician by training, and I am curious about some odd things I see related to the bell shaped curve that accompanies the time (in seconds) it takes for one to solve a cryptogram.

There are five numbers shown at the bottom of each bell shaped curve, which I assume are related to the statistics of the collection of times taken by all the solvers for one cryptogram , or perhaps just including solvers who are competing. For discussion purposes, I name these five values from left to right as follows: Min, Low, Mid, Hi, Max.

I discovered that the ratios of Max:Mid and Hi:Mid are always the same: 5.0 and 3.0 respectively. But, the ratios of Mid:Min and Mid:Low change for each cryptogram. For the five cryptograms I have just looked at, the Mid:Min ratio range in value from 4.67 to 6.78, and the Mid:Min ratio range in value from 1.65 to 1.73.

Statistically, this makes no sense.

pootie49

12-03-2011, 06:53 PM

um, a whawhat?

Well you chose the right tactic to shut me up...you used math.

You might need to send a pm to admin and he can explain it or one of our many

extremely bright players will have a better answer.

Heck I have no idea. I simply am not able to grasp mathematical concepts.

All I do know how to do is solve and hope I have a decent time and maybe now and

then set a record.

erm hold on a tick....five cryptograms? Out of tens of thousands.

Is that a fair assessment?

I thought making a conclusion or having a theory required considerably more

data than that?

Well you chose the right tactic to shut me up...you used math.

You might need to send a pm to admin and he can explain it or one of our many

extremely bright players will have a better answer.

Heck I have no idea. I simply am not able to grasp mathematical concepts.

All I do know how to do is solve and hope I have a decent time and maybe now and

then set a record.

erm hold on a tick....five cryptograms? Out of tens of thousands.

Is that a fair assessment?

I thought making a conclusion or having a theory required considerably more

data than that?

pajarito7

12-03-2011, 07:15 PM

BuzzBuzz,

The Bell-shaped curve graphics to the contrary, the distributions (particularly for puzzles that have not been solved enough times) are not Gaussian. Admin is using the median for his average.

The Bell-shaped curve graphics to the contrary, the distributions (particularly for puzzles that have not been solved enough times) are not Gaussian. Admin is using the median for his average.

BuzzBuzz

12-03-2011, 09:48 PM

BuzzBuzz,

The Bell-shaped curve graphics to the contrary, the distributions (particularly for puzzles that have not been solved enough times) are not Gaussian. Admin is using the median for his average.

Hi Parajito:

Thank you for your help. I understand that the distibution cannot be Gaussian since negative solution times are not possible. I had guessed that the center of the bell shape curve shown was likely calculated as a median rather than a mean since that would be a more useful statistic. I appreicate your confirming this for me.

I would also like to understand why the Hi and Max values are calcualted respectively as exactly three times the median and five times the median. I am also curious about how the Min and Low values are calculated. Can you help me with that?

The Bell-shaped curve graphics to the contrary, the distributions (particularly for puzzles that have not been solved enough times) are not Gaussian. Admin is using the median for his average.

Hi Parajito:

Thank you for your help. I understand that the distibution cannot be Gaussian since negative solution times are not possible. I had guessed that the center of the bell shape curve shown was likely calculated as a median rather than a mean since that would be a more useful statistic. I appreicate your confirming this for me.

I would also like to understand why the Hi and Max values are calcualted respectively as exactly three times the median and five times the median. I am also curious about how the Min and Low values are calculated. Can you help me with that?

BuzzBuzz

12-03-2011, 10:02 PM

um, a whawhat?

Well you chose the right tactic to shut me up...you used math.

You might need to send a pm to admin and he can explain it or one of our many

extremely bright players will have a better answer.

Hi Pootie:

I am sorry my math shut you up. That was not my intention. It was to get a response like the one pajarito sent. Thanks for your suggestion about sending a pm to admin. I will do that if this thread fails to give me that answers I seek.

You are right about five examples generally not being enough for a useful statistical analysis. However, for the particular results I got (unchanging values for all five examples) for two of the ratios, five examples are sufficient.

Well you chose the right tactic to shut me up...you used math.

You might need to send a pm to admin and he can explain it or one of our many

extremely bright players will have a better answer.

Hi Pootie:

I am sorry my math shut you up. That was not my intention. It was to get a response like the one pajarito sent. Thanks for your suggestion about sending a pm to admin. I will do that if this thread fails to give me that answers I seek.

You are right about five examples generally not being enough for a useful statistical analysis. However, for the particular results I got (unchanging values for all five examples) for two of the ratios, five examples are sufficient.

pootie49

12-04-2011, 12:02 AM

okey dokey then

but those that know me know im gonna ask this...

er whatcha doing this for??

Again you came to site full of people who solve puzzles ergo youve piqued some interest as to

why you are doing this, is it a hobby? Are you creating a similar site of your own?

You know just general curiousity questions

If its nowt my business thats cool

its not easy to solve these is it? sorry was just checking your stats anyhoo

i see Pajarito is doing a fabulous job of answering.

thanks P7

but those that know me know im gonna ask this...

er whatcha doing this for??

Again you came to site full of people who solve puzzles ergo youve piqued some interest as to

why you are doing this, is it a hobby? Are you creating a similar site of your own?

You know just general curiousity questions

If its nowt my business thats cool

its not easy to solve these is it? sorry was just checking your stats anyhoo

i see Pajarito is doing a fabulous job of answering.

thanks P7

pajarito7

12-04-2011, 12:04 AM

BuzzBuzz,

The values for Mid (median) and Min (record time) are fixed data points. The other points are calculated:

Hi=3*Mid

Max=5*Mid

Low= (Min+Mid)/2

No standard deviations or variances here:)

The values for Mid (median) and Min (record time) are fixed data points. The other points are calculated:

Hi=3*Mid

Max=5*Mid

Low= (Min+Mid)/2

No standard deviations or variances here:)

BuzzBuzz

12-04-2011, 02:45 AM

BuzzBuzz,

The values for Mid (median) and Min (record time) are fixed data points. The other points are calculated:

Hi=3*Mid

Max=5*Mid

Low= (Min+Mid)/2

No standard deviations or variances here:)

Thanks Pajarito.

The values for Mid (median) and Min (record time) are fixed data points. The other points are calculated:

Hi=3*Mid

Max=5*Mid

Low= (Min+Mid)/2

No standard deviations or variances here:)

Thanks Pajarito.

BuzzBuzz

12-04-2011, 02:59 AM

okey dokey then

but those that know me know im gonna ask this...

er whatcha doing this for??

P7

Hi Pootie:

I like games and puzzles. I have already solved over 100 cryptograms here, but not competively. When I didn't use hints, my times were awful, way to the right. So I started using hints to see how much they help me. Using maximum hints, my times average less than the median (center of the bell). My plan is to continue to practive using hints, and gradually use less of them until I can solve without hints in a time that is competitive. To gauge my progress I needed to invent a statistical measure. So I examined the behavior of Min, Low, Mid, Hi, and Max in order to figure out some formula that would tell me what I wanted to know about my progress. What I have just learned from Pajarito will help me improve the measure I am using.

but those that know me know im gonna ask this...

er whatcha doing this for??

P7

Hi Pootie:

I like games and puzzles. I have already solved over 100 cryptograms here, but not competively. When I didn't use hints, my times were awful, way to the right. So I started using hints to see how much they help me. Using maximum hints, my times average less than the median (center of the bell). My plan is to continue to practive using hints, and gradually use less of them until I can solve without hints in a time that is competitive. To gauge my progress I needed to invent a statistical measure. So I examined the behavior of Min, Low, Mid, Hi, and Max in order to figure out some formula that would tell me what I wanted to know about my progress. What I have just learned from Pajarito will help me improve the measure I am using.

pajarito7

12-04-2011, 06:55 AM

Thanks Pajarito.

You are welcome, BuzzBuzz.

Happy solving!

You are welcome, BuzzBuzz.

Happy solving!

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